The teachings of Michael and Debi Pearl appear to be Biblical and logical on the surface, but research and experience has shown them to be otherwise. This web page is meant to be a clearing house of information and arguments against these teachings.
I started this page on July 27, 2004 with my arguments against the Pearls’ teachings, as well as my husband’s arguments and a few more arguments. I then started adding as many links as I could find.
I have continued to add information as I find it. Now, on March 9, 2010 I am joining the 21st century and moving my humble website to a fancy new WordPress blog. This would not have been possible without the help of Reb from Reb Web Design to whom I own a debt of gratitude for donating this site and starting it up.
If you want more information about me, here is what I believe and here is my personal webpage.
Do you have anything which belongs on this site? Please send any links or anything you have written to HermanaLinda@WhyNotTrainaChild.com. I will not post anything without the author’s permission.
You may also join this site. If you wish to contribute, please email me so I can change you from subscriber to contributor. You will then be able to submit work to me and should I chose to post it, your name will be on it.
I also have an RSS feed which you may use in any RSS reader.
This blog rests on Sundays.
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This is utterly ridiculous. For those of you who are jumping on the bandwagon without reading the whole book you are really missing out on what God has intended for you and the joy you and your children can have. The bible clearly states, “he that spares the rod, spoils the child” If you do not spank your children then what exacltly is working for you? Do you have sweet children? Do they obey you the first time? Or do you have to count to ten and call them 10 times before exploding and yelling at them, those are the kind of people who end up “spanking” but really its abuse because they got so mad and really end up despising their children because they hate to be around them. People who spank there children in a calm manner and who are absolutely consistant 100 % of the time will have tremendous success. However you will not have success with any approach unless you yourself have true joy. Children know if you are faking it. Joy is the byproduct of thankfulness and love. Your joy radiates to your children. Michael Pearl also recomends spending so much time with your children, they are your first and foremost responsibility, they must know that you delight in there presence, get on there level, do what they enjoy, do somthing that makes them smile every 5 minutes. But does anyone say that on this website? There are many more things I could go on and say but those who really want to know more know where they can get the information. I would love to compare a houseful of “Michael Pearl” children who love and reverence him and are a great addition to society to the “non spanked” let them do what they want group, who is probably still working at jack in the box with numerous tattoos and peircings, pregnant at 15 and has no relationship with their parents.
Hello Crystal,
Welcome to my site. To answer your question, yes, I have read “To Train up a Child” and many of Michael Pearl’s articles. It would be impossible to argue against his teachings without reading them first. I mainly link to others’ arguments. I can’t say for how much everyone else has read, but I’m sure that they have read enough. I have testimonies from people who used to follow Pearl’s teachings and they have read even more than I. I encourage you to read the arguments and really try to understand what we are saying. We are not saying to not discipline. We are not encouraging anyone to call their children 10 times and then explode and yell. We encourage firm, consistent and gentle discipline. You might be surprised what you’ll learn here, if you stick around. May God bless you.
Crystal, I want you to know that I have responded to your comment in greater detail here.
Crystal,
I’ve seen both families — where the kids were never spanked, and where the kids were spanked. The ones who weren’t are the ones with the relationship with their parents, and the ones who were spanked…well, don’t. I’m one of the kids from that family. I dare you (and anyone else) to read this post of mine and tell me this isn’t abuse. This is what the Pearls advocate.
Thank you so much for your comment. I am glad to find your blog.
You’re welcome! Thanks for linking me!
Crystal–thanks for sharing. I would like to add to what you wrote, that just because a parent spanked a child or a parent did not spank his child does not mean the spanked child doesn’t have a relationship, while the non-spanked child did have a relationship with parents. I find that to be bad logic, because it’s a generalization based on your own personal experience.
I am not a Train up Your Child advocate or reader. I find most of what I have seen or read to be unappealing to say the least. But, I don’t think making generalizations about spanked children & non-spanked children merits enough backing to say one promotes relationship & the other doesn’t. We have all see permissive parents who never spanked a lick, nor did they ever set boundaries or tell their children “no.” I have seen these children (family members, peers, & years of childcare) lacking respect & concern for their parent.
On the flip side, spanking to break a will or to use it the way in which is advocated by the Pearls, garners results, but not out of a heart that is in right relationship with the parent. That discipline can promote children who respond out of fear & not out of true desire to obey.
I simply wanted to point out the difference, because I strongly dislike when people make generalizations about something so deep to a parent. thanks.
Anne, I am the oldest of 9 children in a Christian home where we were spanked, not abused and to my knowledge spanking has not driven anyone away from my parents. Please realize that the group you speak of as having no relationship with their parents due to being spanked is not indicative of us all.
Proper spanking is not abusive and I have to question why bible believing Christians would disregard the scripture’s admonition to use the “rod”. But just like with eating food, or drinking alcohol (which I don’t practice anyways) some take it too far and sin by doing so.
Tracy, welcome to my blog. I appreciate that you have a great relationship with your parents. I realize that you are not alone. Human relationships are very complicated and there is no guaranteed formula. I have not known of many children to be driven away from their parents just because they were spanked, there are almost always other factors. However, spanking can cause a host of other problems leading to diminished or entirely broken emotional health. The problem is that there is no way to predict which children will be stricken with such effects.
Please check out the links in my side bar for a clearer understanding of what the Rod is and how to use it.
Crystal, you are absolutely correct.
For those of you who seem to emotionally offer a sacrifice of personal opinion that DIFFERS from the Bible, I will include actual SCRIPTURES NOT OPINION to end the debate. Any continued debate is only by your opposition to biblical principles. Stop using the Bible as a “coupon book” to select ONLY the scriptures that fit YOUR perspectives. The Bible does not align to you and your human views, we must align to the Word.
We are the ones that were recently on with the Pearls and telling you FIRST hand how the media and liberal left totally spins and skews the truth. It’s not real folks… the perspective of non-biblical discipline is not real – it’s media and liberally spun to hook on to your emotions – pure and simple. Anyhoo, here’s the scriptures if you really want to base your opinions on bible:
Deuteronomy 8:5
“You should know in your heart that as a man chastens his son, so the LORD your God chastens you.”
[Note: "chastens" means to chastise literally with blows or figuratively with words]
Deuteronomy 21:18
“If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother, and who, when they have chastened him, will not heed them,”
Proverbs 10:13
“Wisdom is found on the lips of him who has understanding, But a rod is for the back of him who is devoid of understanding.”
Proverbs 13:24
“He who spares his rod hates his son, But he who loves him disciplines him promptly.”
Proverbs 15:10
“Harsh discipline is for him who forsakes the way, And he who hates correction will die.”
Proverbs 17:10
“Rebuke is more effective for a wise man Than a hundred blows on a fool.”
Proverbs 19:18
“Chasten your son while there is hope, And do not set your heart on his destruction.”
Proverbs 19:25
“Strike a scoffer, and the simple will become wary; Rebuke one who has understanding, and he will discern knowledge.”
Proverbs 19:29
“Judgments are prepared for scoffers, And beatings for the backs of fools.”
Proverbs 20:30
“Blows that hurt cleanse away evil, As do stripes the inner depths of the heart.”
Proverbs 22:6
“Train up a child in the way he should go, And when he is old he will not depart from it.”
Proverbs 22:15
“Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child; The rod of correction will drive it far from him.”
Proverbs 23:13-14
“Do not withhold correction from a child, For if you beat him with a rod, he will not die. You shall beat him with a rod, And deliver his soul from hell.”
Proverbs 26:3
“A whip for the horse, A bridle for the donkey, And a rod for the fool’s back.”
Proverbs 29:15
“The rod and rebuke give wisdom, But a child left to himself brings shame to his mother.”
Proverbs 29:17
“Correct your son, and he will give you rest; Yes, he will give delight to your soul.”
Hebrews 12:5-11
“And you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks to you as to sons: “My son, do not despise the chastening of the LORD, Nor be discouraged when you are rebuked by Him; For whom the LORD loves He chastens, And scourges every son whom He receives.” If you endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom a father does not chasten? But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons. Furthermore, we have had human fathers who corrected us, and we paid them respect. Shall we not much more readily be in subjection to the Father of spirits and live? For they indeed for a few days chastened us as seemed best to them, but He for our profit, that we may be partakers of His holiness. Now no chastening seems to be joyful for the present, but painful; nevertheless, afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.”
You keep mentioning being on with the Pearls. When was this? Please supply a link, I have yet to see that show.
We have discussed those verses in this blog before. The English is just translated, in order to really understand the verses one must look at the Inspired Greek and Hebrew and take it in context. We have done word studies on the Greek and Hebrew in order to come to our conclusions.
“Any continued debate is only by your opposition to biblical principles.”
Or perhaps that of Mike Pearl and his supporters. Let us not leap before looking more closely.
Those willing to look around this site will find my blog posts listed under “pro-spankers’ arguments,” so let’s just dispose of the idea that this is a spank/don’t-spank issue.
As to the Bible, see Parenting in the Name of God for a comprehensive review in which my husband and I had the disappointment of finding that Mike Pearl’s teachings are not in the least biblical.
For myself, I do not condemn spanking; I strongly advise against trying to discipline a child in any way using Pearl’s theological basis, because Pearl literalizes via King James English to equate “flesh” with the physical body, and denies the existence of a sin nature. This false doctrine of sin and the flesh naturally tends to invoke an unbalanced or even extreme approach to physical, outward control.
Hence the irrational concept that training with switching is not punishment, etc. Pearl even has an article entitled “Training Fleshy Flesh” (available on his website), the very title of which links his false theological assumptions with his methodology.
I would caution serious ministers of the Gospel to be very aware and very discerning about what they are linking their name and ministry to before they step out in support of NGJ. The problem is not how biased the media, society and the modern church are; if we follow Christ, we will see some form of persecution, you, me and the next believer.
Far more seriously, we have a Lord God to whom we will give account for how we shepherded His flock, and for how we represented His holy name and His Word. Before we get carried away by emotional reactionism to the world’s dissent against the Gospel, and find ourselves in a knee-jerk defensive stance (or even attacking and accusing fellow believers), we must indeed consider Scripture.
I saw your article at the Christian Post. I was very surprised, shocked really, to see you quote from and link to ChristianDomesticDiscipline.com Do you defend Christian Domestic Discipline (corporeal punishment of wives)?
I’d say by the fact that he’s referring to columnists by name, that he knows exactly what he’s talking about with that thinly-veiled pornographic website, which by the way, I see embraces eroticism in the wife-spanking in its clauses of beliefs. Sick.
Fox, you’ve got some explaining to do if you want to convince folks on this site that you’re not a obscene creep, and that your apparent obsession with spanking, given in such detail above, isn’t some kind of freaky outburst of online exhibitionism. That’s no way to use the Bible, but I’m sure the Lord’ll have you straightened out on that eventually.
Y’know, Linda, after this, I’m just waiting for the Pearl supporter who shows up in Monty Python garb and plays a trumpet with his rear end…
Hello from the Holy Land,
I’ve noted a number of responses and the one which is the most interesting is that of Mr and Mrs Fox.
While they have presented their view of God’s supposed teaching in the Scripture, I would be delighted to enter into a Scripturally oriented discussion with them concerning their views. Unfortunately, the Bible and its complexities are just not so neat and tidy and Mr. and Mrs. Fox are suggesting.
Let me know if your interested. I’ll be happy to send you a copy of my which you both would be welcomed to offer me correction on.
Looking forward to that opportunity.
Samuel Martin
http://www.samuelmartin.blogspot.com
Jerusalem Israel
@Crystal
Why YES Crystal there are billions of children all over this world and parents that raise happy, healthy, INDEPENDENT, intelligent, creative, and again >>>INDEPENDENT<<< Kids withOUT spanking, beating, starving, torturing, and then murdering them.
I will give you one point. Do I have to count to 10? Got me there… sort of. I don't even have to count to 3 or 1. There are no issues. My secret. Communication. I know it is a big word but take the time to learn it. If you are old enough to breed you need to be old enough to handle big words and raise a child like a parent not by reactions seen during 1st grade recess.
“For those of you who are jumping on the bandwagon without reading the whole book”
Crystal, I’m happy to be able to inform you that this is not an accurate representation of the case. For just myself, for starters, my husband and I perused not only “Train Up,” but the three print volumes of NGJ newsletter articles, the website content, a few web clips, and several audio sermons.
I am a writer and editor who’s been published in The Old Schoolhouse and Homeschooling Today; my husband is the president of a Bible conference dedicated to Creation-to-Christ-style foundational biblical teaching, which is so often set aside in favour of entertainment and doctrinal indifference. It mattered to us to know for sure what the situation was.
“do you have to count to ten and call them 10 times before exploding and yelling at them”
No.
Now, I don’t assume your children are abused simply because you find useful material in the Pearls’ products. Let me just take the words you’ve used, because the circumstances line up: It’s unfortunate that this is the impression of those who have jumped on a bandwagon without “reading the whole book” of various parenting experiences, so to speak. I apologize if that sounds harsh, but I want to make the point that if premature judgment is wrong, it’s wrong on all sides.
I can understand why you would feel the need to speak strongly, when much of the outcry against NGJ has taken a vituperative tone, and some of it has been from those with strikingly different faith philosophies. But that is not the sum of the case.
I do not agree with calling people down for how they parent, regardless of their stance on the Pearls. Those I’ve come in contact with are not evil, abusive parents — on either side of the fence. They are people upset by the issues at hand, who are concerned for what’s right.
“Children know if you are faking it.”
Agree 100%.
“Michael Pearl also recomends spending so much time with your children, they are your first and foremost responsibility, they must know that you delight in there presence, get on there level, do what they enjoy, do somthing that makes them smile every 5 minutes.”
And this is good advice in and of itself, were it not underpinned by a very bad theology of conditioning (using both negative and the abovementioned positive techniques) for religious acquiescence towards an obedience theology rather than biblical salvation. I know that sounds truly horrible. I did not expect to find it the way it turned out to be. My husband and I were really grieved by what a thorough examination of NGJ materials brought to light as we wrote up the Parenting in the Name of God series.
“I would love to compare a houseful of “Michael Pearl” children who love and reverence him and are a great addition to society to the “non spanked” let them do what they want group”
If you browse the blogs linked here, you won’t have to wish in vain, as many of them have plenty of material on their family lives. I encourage you to go ahead and do exactly that, for the sake of understanding one another and hopefully edifying one another in the desire for closer conformity to Christ. Linda has made a point of linking specifically to arguments from those who identify Christian. Generally, I find that a look through a few blog entries allows me to determine whether I have overall doctrinal and parenting philosophy agreement.
God bless.
I just wanted to take a moment to say thank you for this. I’ve been reviewing positive parenting resources for some time with a great deal of skepticism. I was a firm believer in Dobson and many other tough love for strong willed children ideals. However, a friend of mine recently described it best “Like the definition of insanity, I tried the same thing over and over expecting different results.” I began to feel a twinge of doubt even after my first child but wrote him off as strong willed. He is speech delayed and eventually the complexity of raising a child with special needs and his two younger siblings was not unavoidable. Something had to give.
The different approach shows results immediately although I do feel that children “test” that in the same way they would any other positive or negative boundaries. Still, I’d much rather err on the side of positive right? I also find that this approach is literally harder- it requires more work emotionally and mentally and requires me to literally rewrite my own ingrained assumptions on parenthood and child rearing.
I have to say when I first started reading Crystal’s reply from a year ago, I was a bit upset. But now, I totally understand: That was me. And I have found that reverting seems wildly effective for the first bit (I had surgery recently and others methods were unavoidable as I needed the help) but eventually children seem to revert to a “fight or flight” mentality and either contract emotionally or become more brazen in their behavior- or a combination there of. It’s a vicious cycle. Spanking seemed to be working? Are they “testing me” now? Not really, but they certainly aren’t learning in the way you truly want them to.
I will say with great gratitude now that with a new approach, I finally see what my friends were talking about with a 4 year old who will talk your ear off to exhaustion. He really comes out of his shell and his behaviors seem to regulate in amazing ways. I’m not avoiding punishment- I’m offering direction in ways that can’t be inhibited by his language barrier. I’m offering him the option to gain approval and acceptance with good behavior rather than waiting until he’s already on the other end to give him my valued attention. My 78 year old grandmother said it best “Children will get your attention one way or another- good or bad” Thanks for this site as I continue to research other resources for this approach. I wish there were a way to get though to people like my former self before the stress and angst that can come from failure with the wrong approach! I feel so much more successful as a mother now and I’m grateful for that!
Thank you so much for your comment. <3 It is for this reason that I was called to make the site. All Glory to God!
I can’t find any way to contact you besides this, but I wanted to let you know that I have two articles on spanking on my blog that you might be interested in posting like you do. I have another article I’m going to put up in a few days. http://lovejoyfeminism.blogspot.com/2011/06/casting-pearls-back-to-swine.html and http://lovejoyfeminism.blogspot.com/2011/07/giving-child-rod.html. Thanks, and GOOD WORK! People need to be saying what you’re saying!
This website appears to be another sign of the times. False converts. carnal Christians and effeminate men gathering to attack basic Bible teachings. George Soros, GLBA and every other Atheist group would be proud of your work. This material is similar to Time magazine trying to teach the Bible and use it to support sodomy, civil unions, animal rights, environmentalism, global warming, abolition of private property, wealth redistribution (i.e. communism) and whatever Satan is working on next. However much you may think some deranged couple harming their child proves your position, the word of God will not change. Evil doers will do evil no matter what they are handed. No doubt this site will also gather those who were improperly chastised themselves yet the word of God remains. Go to the greek, hebrew, jewish rabbis, heathen psychologists, clinical studies, association of Pediatricians and whoever else you garner in your devilish quest to try to disprove and outlaw proper Biblical discipline. The most basic metric which is this current generation is ever against you and all that you contend for . American children are more dangerous than ever now that most in the nation do not discipline with corporal punishment. And we were told that spanking makes children deranged and violent yet this generation which has largely never been spanked is more fierce, vicious and violent than any since the founding of the nation. It is a nation of rebels, effeminate, haters of God, boasters, despisers of those that are good and disobedient to parents. Such a cause as yours will always gather a crowd (especially in the name of Christ) but it will wind up in Hell with all of the other groups that want to save America from imaginary problems and dodge the real crises that we face. May God give some of you the grace to repent and depart from this God forsaken website and its teachings. (Revelation 3:19)
Sincerely Yours in Christ.
Dear Brother O’Neill,
I fail to see how you could read the carefully thought out Biblical arguments on this site and come to such a conclusion. The Bible teaches us to scrutinize the Bible and expose false teachings. I post arguments and you are welcome to post counter arguments. However, I do not see Biblical arguments in your comment, just harsh, unfounded condemnation and insults. In fact, your comment is full of the kind of abuse which has caused many children who were “properly chastised” (as you call it) to renounce Christ and become apostates. I avoid linking to their (non-Christian) arguments, although I will occasionally link to their impassioned testimonies as they demonstrate the oft results of harsh training in a way nothing else will.
You seen to link the study of Scripture in the original Greek and Hebrew to the study of heathen psychologists, clinical studies, association of Pediatricians etc. I don’t understand this at all so I probably misunderstood you. I do not link to or post arguments basted on heathen psychologists and clinical studies, i stick to Biblical arguments and those of Christians. Of course as the Bible was written in Greek and Hebrew, it is imperative to understand the meaning of of the Greek and Hebrew. Or are you of the opinion that the King James is more inspired than the original Hebrew and Greek?
I do not advocate permissive parenting nor lack of discipline. I advocate firm, Gentle and Grace Based Discipline which is Biblical. If you really believe that the Bible teaches harsh corporal punishment and will not consider any arguments to the contrary, then we really have nothing to discuss.
Blessings,
Hermana Linda
It is for this reason that I was called to make the site. All Glory to God!
Who called you? It definitely wasn’t the Lord. There is no glory here either that will go to Him. God have mercy on you.
I am convinced that the Lord called me to do this work. However, you are convinced that He called you to attack me. He knows who He called. We hear His voice and follow. Some people respond to those with whom they disagree with gentleness and grace and others with harsh condemnation. By our fruits are we known.
“There is no glory here either that will go to Him.”
{chuckle} Gotta love a stranger on the internet who exhibits the spiritual gift of omniscience…just sayin’.
Deut. 18:19-23
Doesn’t matter which side of the fence we land on, a basic fear of the Lord is a worthwhile thing to remember if one calls themselves a Bible believer.
Linda, I know in my heart that the Lord has given you to this work. God bless you as you serve where the One Master has placed you.
To the critics: I have never seen Hermana Linda be anything but charitable to those who are the Lord’s. But we are all called & charged to speak the truth, & to call to account those who distort the Gospel to their own ends, & that is what I find here.
Thank you. <3 All the glory to God. †
See,if you keep people talking long enough, they always betray their heart. Note closely and clearly how Mike and Trisha Fox let Deut 21:18 slip out. Here’s the whole passage; the conclusion should be obvious:
18If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them:
19Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place;
20And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard.
21And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.
The only other interesting thing here is whether they consider themselves qualified to cast the first one…
Do you mind if I link to this website on my blog? I’ve been writing articles on the Pearls for several months now , and I want to share some links from people who are on the same page as me. I just want to make sure it’s OK, because my blog is not only about the Pearls and contains language and concepts that some people might find offensive. If you don’t want to be linked because of this, that’s totally fine and I completely understand.
Merry Christmas!
~ Lynn “GoesKaboom”
Thank you so much for asking. I don’t mind at all. It sounds like it’s best that I not link to you, but you are always welcome to link to me.
Thank you! I appreciate it- I feel like if I have some links to other people saying the same things it might help add credibility. Anything anyone can do to boost the signal about what the Pearls do is a good thing- maybe someone might stumble across it and change their mind about using this book.
~Lynn
I’ve raised and home schooled three children. The youngest just turned 18. All three are doing well, serving the Lord, and the older two love visiting our home. We are a happy family, by the grace of God alone!
I remember being exposed to Debi and Michael Pearl early in our home schooling years. I liked some of what Debi had to write and grew from it.
But one day I read something by Michael about potty training a young boy. The child had messed his pants and Dad took him outside and washed his bottom off with a garden hose.
Something clicked inside and I thought, “That’s abuse. That’s not training..that’s abuse.” I was outraged for that child and put down the Pearls forever. The house of cards began tumbling down. My husband and I heard Lindvall at a convention. What a nutcase. Mark Hamblin was a ranter. I finished home schooling my oldest, and put my other two in Christian schools. I know some home schooling families who have finished very, very well. Others, not so well. I’ve known some families who have had their children in public schools with remarkable results: godly, reverent children.
It is all the grace of God. And I thank Him often that He covered my Pearl stained sins against my children and that they have thrived in spite of it all.
Thank you for that testimony. Glory to God that you were able to recognize abuse, so many are somehow blinded to that.
I find it quite telling that the Pearl fans are very harsh and insulting while the gentle people actually display the fruit of the Spirit. The Pearl fans claim we misuse the Bible, when it is really they who are doing this. They need to study Galatians 5:22 because they are NOT showing any evidence of the fruit of the Spirit by hurling insults, harsh words, and inaccurate claims. I almost wonder if they even know God. God is LOVE! And the Glory of the Lord is on this page!
Please visit Dr. Paul’s website on parenting, and you might be particularly interested in the Nov newsletter which deals with the problems of physical punishment.
You might also like to go to psychologytodayblogs and look at Dr. Holinger’s blogs on infant and child development.
Thank you. Steph, our Child Development Expert, found this very helpful.