Christian arguments against the Pearls' teachings.
Cindy Foster of The Baptist Taliban blog explains why she no longer believes in spanking in, I’m Coming Out!
Along similar lines, Dara Stoltzfus has some interesting things to say about parenting teenagers in Spanking puts the parent in a bad autopilot mode…
And speaking of Dara, she also takes a very good look at the question, Does more spanking = less crime and delinquency?
Samuel Martin looks at child-rearing in the Bible Lands both then and now in True Eastern Wisdom Is Coming West.
Samuel Martin asks us all to join him in praying for “the peace of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ on all under His sun suffering from family violence.”
Speaking of peace, Carissa Robinson encourages us to run to The Father with our problems for He will give us peace in Paideia, Part 3.
Samuel Martin has the following to say about his essay, O Wretched Child that I am.
This text may be the most important New Testament scripture for those parents who have small children – I Corinthians 2:11. “For who knows a person’s thoughts except the spirit of that person, which is in him?” – Why? Read why here!
He also said this about the same post:
“At one year of age, man is a king, fondled and doted upon by all. At two and three he is a pig, groping in the garbage. At ten he prances around like a kid. At twenty he is a horse, preening himself in search of a wife.” – This post covers a lot of ground surrounding Paul’s view of himself and how we can especially relate that issue to how we view our children.
He also has an interesting look at child rearing in Biblical times:
One day we won’t have to keep them so close, but until then: Hang on tight – Part One
One day we won’t have to keep them so close, but until then: Hang on tight – Part Two
Dulce de Leche hosts a post by Samuel Martin on the topic of How Jesus Would Parent, in which we look at an example of Jesus using Gentle Parenting.
Samuel Martin takes a look at what the Bible says about spanking in Christian Scholars and Preachers Disagree on Spanking Children.
Dulce de Leche continues her 10 Commandments for Parents series with 10 Commandments for Parents: Forsaking All Others.
Samuel Martin continues to try to dialog with pro-spankers. I’m not sure why he is having such a hard time finding someone who will take him up on this challenge.
In Samuel Martin’s latest blog post: Women’s Intuition and Corporal Punishment: Did you feel intuitively that spanking/smacking your children was wrong? he asks women to go to http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/5DQ6M3B and give him your input.
Samuel Martin has posted the following on Facebook:
I want to connect with fundamentalist Christians advocating spanking kids who are willing to read my book with the view to show me how I am in error in my findings – So far all of the people who I have connected with have yet to give me specific written critique of my work, except one and that person did not even end up totally disagreeing with my work. Please if you have any connections with people who would be interested in seeing learning advanced, help me connect with those parties so we can start a greater debate on this issue. Hope to hear from you – info@biblechild.com
Please have interested parties email him at info@biblechild.com or use his Contact Form.
The United Church Observer has published an article called, To Spank Or Not to Spank, by Sarah Boesveld about the spanking controversy in Canada. While I am glad that the United Church of Canada has taken a public stand against spanking, I do not link to this as Christian arguments, but of interest as a news story. Canadian Evangelical, C.L. Dyke of Scita Scienda, explains why in a comment which I will reproduce here.
The greater context to this is that the UCC is a denomination which has thrown out orthodox (I use the word generically, not denominationally) Christian doctrine in favour of unbridled humanism. They actively disavow the deity of Jesus Christ and the authority of the Bible–scripture is a text to be interpreted by today’s shifting social customs, and filtered for generic principles common to human decency, rather than a narrative deserving of the same respect and scholarly approach as any other ancient text.
The quote in the article about supporting the oppressed lines up to this:
–Support anti-spanking
–Support homosexual advocacy and lobbying
–Support abortion (hmm, an interesting clash of principle occurs here)
–Reject the deity of Jesus Christ and His calling upon humankind to repent of sin and accept personal, substitutionary salvation based on Christ’s atonement; eject pastors who preach it.
Meanwhile, Canadian law is already very pro-child.
In writ, it is illegal to spank under the age of 2 or over the age of 12; it is illegal to leave so much as a red mark; it is illegal to spank with an implement.
In practice, spanking of any kind has the potential to incur social services intervention.
As someone who is anti-Pearl and pro-attached/gentle parenting, but not anti-spanking across the board, I feel the scales are already sufficiently balanced against the principles of individual freedom in our country’s legal system.
While the compassion expressed for Hana Williams’ horrific death is only appropriate, the UCC’s word is pretty tainted to me as a Canadian evangelical. I’m not sure how we are to see the brokenness of humanity healed without Christ.
The UCC’s solution is moral relativism and socialism. Given the (for now) fringe push on the far left to accept pedophilia under the guise of “children’s sexual rights,” that approach doesn’t avail for me as a guarantor of children’s rights and safety in this life, all eternal considerations aside.
Samuel Martin looks at Corporal and Eternal Punishment in 3 parts:
Corporal and Eternal Punishment: Time to disconnect these two ideas once and for all – Part One
Corporal and Eternal Punishment: Time to disconnect these two ideas once and for all – Part Two
Corporal and Eternal Punishment: Time to disconnect these two ideas once and for all – Part Three
Author Samuel Martin says in his latest blog post that he is now willing to send a free PDF of his book, Thy Rod and Thy Staff They Comfort Me: Christians And The Spanking Controversy to anyone who emails him at info@biblechild.com to request it.
Edited to add: Samuel Martin says,
I just saw on Amazon that hard copies of my book are selling for $207.33 US Dollars. Can that be possible? I can tell you that that is not right. If you do like to get a hard copy of my book (Thy Rod and Thy Staff, They Comfot Me: Christians and the Spanking Controversy – The first edition is still in print, but not for much longer), just call 1 800 204 2063 – www.archivesbookshop.com – A great source for all of your new and used Christian book needs. But my free ebook is still free and remains free until corporal punishment/smacking/spanking of children ends – write info@biblechild.com to get yours.
Samuel Martin has posted an extended excerpt from Chapter 7 of his book, Thy Rod and Thy Staff, They Comfort Me: Christians and the Spanking Controversy, in which he looks at Proverbs 23:13-14, “Do not withhold correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and deliver his soul from hell.”
By the way, someone told me that they were having a problem finding where to purchase Samuel Martin’s book because on Amazon they are charging $90. Well, you may purchase it here for under $11.
Samuel Martin explains why we should consider reading modern translations of the Bible when seeking to understand Proverbs 19:18.
Chasten thy son while there is hope, and let not thy soul spare for his crying. (Proverbs 19:18 – King James Version)
Samuel Martin has posted a rebuttal to a quote Pearl made during his debate with Janet Heimlich in The Christian Post.
Bible Scholar, Samuel Martin, looks at what the Bible says about the nurturing of infants and toddlers.
Since that is part 2 of a series, here is part 1.
Teresa from Teresa’s Whine And Cheese takes a good look at claims that Kids Today Are Worse Then they Used To Be in Correlation, causation, and the proof in the pudding.
Pastor Tim of Way Point Church discusses discerning the Biblical view in Biblical Christianity in which he states “[The Pearls'] claim to have a biblical view on parenting is delusional.”
Samuel Martin looks how Christian Scholars and Preachers Disagree on Spanking Children and explains what the commonly used verses in Proverbs are really saying.
And here is a bonus link. While completely off topic for this blog, I found this video interesting. Someone took an informal poll at a college campus asking the question, “Can Men And Women Be Just Friends?“ The answers might surprise you.
Samuel Martin has sent out the following request asking us to check out and respond to this article in the National Post. He gives a different link to the same story, but my link has photos and lives links.
Dear friends,
Best wishes from Jerusalem.
I would like to ask all of my friends, especially those in Canada, to visit the link in the following article:
http://www.nationalpost.com/todays-paper/pastor+striking+advice/5700731/story.html
- read it and then write to the article author -
- if you agree that we need to give additional attention and information about the Biblical arguements against corporal punishment.
Her excellent article gives a great deal of attention to Mr. Pearl and his views. I think it appropriate that the same attention be given to alternate views based upon high levels of scholarship held by Christians like Prof. William Webb, Prof. Dawn Devries, Emeritus Prof. I. Howard Marshall, Dr. Randall Heskett and myself as well as Jewish scholars like Rabbi Lawrence Kelemen, Rabbi Shlomo Wolbe (of blessed memory)), Rabbi Moses Feinstein (of blessed memory) or others in addition to what was mentioned in the article.
If you agree with that, I would appreciate it if you’d drop the author a message.
Thanks so much.
Samuel Martin
P O Box 21543
Jerusalem 91214 Israel
Website: www.biblechild.com
Email: info@biblechild.com
Samuel Martin has a new post called, I was wrong and how I intend to make it right: A tested Biblical methodology for addressing traditions and false teachings in Christianity.
Speaking of Samuel Martin, he is giving away 2 free books. Here is the info:
Dear friends,
I am delighted to continue endorsing strongly Professor William Webb’s book. I can’t recommend it enough.
Here is where you can get your copy – http://www.ivpress.com/cgi-ivpress/book.pl/toc/code=2761
So, I am pleased to announce that I am giving a copy of this book away. This is the first book I’ve ever given away on my blog and I am pleased that it is this book.
To win this book, all you have to do send me an email (your email address will be kept confidential not to be shared with anyone) with your first and last name to info@biblechild.com answering the following three questions:
1. I have read your book “Thy Rod and Thy Staff, They Comfort Me: Christians and the Spanking Controversy – YES or NO
2. I have read Professor Webb’s book – YES or NO
3. Pick one of the following:
A. If I don’t win the Webb book, I am planning to buy it.
B. I have already bought the Webb book and plan to give away the book if I win it.
C. I have not yet purchased the book by Prof. Webb.
So that is all there is to it. Except for one other thing.
The first name drawn will win the Webb book. Then, I will be drawing another name. The first name that I draw thereafter who answers the question “I have read your book “Thy Rod and Thy Staff, They Comfort Me: Christians and the Spanking Controversy” with a “NO”, will win a free autographed copy of my book.
I look forward to hear from you very soon. This drawing ends 23:59AM Jerusalem time on November 1.
Samuel Martin
Website: www.biblechild.com
Email: info@biblechild.com
Megan Graham of The Daily Illini (Independent Student Newspaper of the University of Illinois) looks at To Train Up A Child and its influence as well as the issue of Free Speech in Parenting book missing childlike innocence.
Prof. William Webb (Author of the new book Corporal Punishment In The Bible) explains that The Pearls’ Teaching is “Gutter Theology.”
You might also be interested in these reviews of the above mentioned book.
C.L. Dyck of Scita Scienda shares her thoughts in Hana Grace Williams and the Myth of My Happiness.
Kathy Cassel of Cassel Crew explains her concerns with To Train Up A Child in (How Not) To Train Up a Child. Note that she does believe in spanking but more as a last resort than as a first and/or only tool.
The Mule explains more about the Petition to Amazon and Why You Should Sign It. This is the same petition you see on my sidebar.
Professor Curtis Hutt of the University of Nebraska shares his view concerning the ongoing debate about violence against children on Samuel Martin’s Blog.
TulipGirl responds to Michael Pearl’s Response to the death of Hanna Williams in When Friends Defend The Pearls.
In her response she links to another response which I had missed from Free By His Grace.
The Sugar Mountain has an impassioned response to the Pearls’ teachings about the rod in Tragedy of the Rod (a deadly misinterpretation).
Also, Bible Scholar, Samuel Martin, is giving away a copy of Corporal Punishment In The Bible by William Webb and maybe YOU can win it. Even if you don’t, you might win a copy of his book, Thy Rod And Thy Staff They Comfort Me. See how to enter here.
Bible Scholar, Samuel Martin explains why he believes that Amazon should stop selling To Train Up A Child. Please sign the petition, the link is in my sidebar.
And here are 2 posts about why the Pearls’ teachings are not Biblical:
Laura Ziesel shares an in depth study of Proverbs 22:6 in Train up a Child in Whose Way?
Samuel Martin shares a statement from Prof. William Webb responding to Hana’s death called, The Pearl’s Beatings Are Not Really Biblical which I am posting in its entirety below at his request.
Wednesday, October 05, 2011
The Newsletter of the
“New Foundation for Biblical Research.”
A project of the Century One Foundation, Inc. (www.centuryone.org)© Samuel MartinSamuel Martin – Project Director – www.biblechild.comEmail: info@biblechild.comOctober 2011
Religious scholars speaking out against the teachings of Michael and Debi PearlMany of you may have by now heard about Hana-Grace Rose Williams, who died in May at the tender age of 13. See the details of her story here and how Michael and Debi Pearl’s book “To Train Up A Child” is yet again being implicated in this horrifying case. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2016361753_hana30m.htmlWhen I saw this, I postponed what I had planned to publish this month and I immediately started writing to a number of religious scholars that I know asking them to speak out on this outrageous, unacceptable and evil publication. Thankfully, my call has immediately been answered by Prof, William Webb of Tyndale Seminary, Toronto, Canada. I know that I will be hearing from other religious scholars very soon and I will be sharing more testimonies and comments from them as I receive them. We need to hear these voices now.Many of you know that I have strongly endorsed Prof. Webb’s book in this newsletter (July 2011 Newsletter). Today, I am herein once again not only endorsing this book, but I am asking you to support this book to ensure that it obtains the widest possible reading, attention and exposure. Rather than telling you what Prof. Webb told me, I am herein including a written communication from him that I received just this morning. The following is a direct quote from Prof. Webb and is used with his permission.THE PEARL’S BEATINGS ARE NOT REALLY BIBLICAL“Although they will tell you it is from the Bible, the Pearl’s version of child discipline is not really biblical. Not in the truest sense. Not in the deepest sense of what should shape biblical authority. Not in a way that honors the Bible’s underlying redemptive spirit. It is utterly heart breaking to watch “Christian materials” written by Michael and Debi Pearl become part of the murder investigations in three separate cases where so-called Christian parents allegedly abused their children in life-threatening and life-ending ways. I am stunned and appalled by what I have seen on CNN, King5 News, etc.Unfortunately, Christians often get stuck in their ability to apply the Bible in today’s world. It is my hope that my recent book (Corporal Punishment in the Bible: A Redemptive-Movement Hermeneutic for Troubling Texts) will inspire hope and positive dialogue that helps the Christian community move towards something better for our children. The book outlines how Marilyn (my wife) and I changed our minds about spanking. Like the Pearls we were severely deluded in thinking that the rod was God’s way. But over time we learned how to read and understand the Bible differently. We also learned a truck-load of non-corporal methods of discipline which were far more weighty and effective than the Dobson version (2 smacks max) and certainly better than the abusive Pearl prescription (many beatings with the rod). Like the slavery texts of Scripture, the answer is not simply in moving towards a better form of slavery. That only captures part of Scripture’s redemptive spirit. The Dobson approach is to be commended because they move away from the Pearl-type literalism. But, that is not where biblical application should stop. Like the slavery issue of past days, we need to move beyond a gentler, kinder form of slavery/corporal punishment. Two smacks max is good but it does not reflect an ultimate ethical application of the Bible. As with slavery, only abolitionism (of the rod) will permit Christians to fully embrace effective non-corporal methods and do the courageous, William Wilberforce action in this hour of time. I pray that contemporary followers of Jesus might be known as those who want to live out the very highest ethical application of Scripture. What the Pearls offer is nothing other than “gutter theology”; it is not really the Bible at all . . . well, not if we want to live out Scripture’s redemptive heartbeat.” Dr. William J. Webb is Adjunct Professor of New Testament at Tyndale Seminary, Toronto, Canada. (Quotation from Prof. Webb ends here.)Brethren, now is the time for all of us to take action to work to stop what is happening today to children at the hands of dear misguided parents/others who think they are doing God’s will.First, I am asking you to take this newsletter and the exact comments of Prof. Webb and post them to your blogs, pass them to your networks, put them on your FACEBOOK pages and disseminate his above referenced quotation as far and as wide as you can. For more links, reviews and other information about Professor Webb and his book see: http://redemptivechristianity.com & http://www.ivpress.com/cgi-ivpress/book.pl/review/code=2761. Please include these in your posts.Second, I am asking you to please buy his book. Get your copy here – https://shop.ivpress.com/epages/IVP.storefront/en/addtobasket/0-8308-2761-7Third, I am asking you to write positive reviews of this book in any forum that you come across including but not limited to Amazon, news sites and other book related sites and blogs.Fourth, I am also you to join me in applauding and supporting InterVarsity Press (www.ivpress.com) for publishing such courageous and careful scholarship. They need to know that we are watching and supporting Christian publishers who stand up for what is right. Please join me in doing this by writing/emailing them or leaving comments on their site.I would like to thank Prof. Webb for standing up and letting his voice be heard through this newsletter at this difficult time. His message is an important one. His work is really an inspiration for those of us who are looking for truth. I am reminded of a quotation from a giant of Biblical scholarship who was a friend of my late father and I think it is appropriate to reference it here. “…we must bear in mind that the cause of learning has often been promoted by scholars who are prepared to take a risk and expose their brain-waves to the pitiless criticisms of others” (F.F.Bruce, “Modern Studies on the Judean Scrolls,” CT, I (11):5).Prof. Webb, thank you for your courage, risk taking, intellectual honesty and standing up and speaking out for the truths of the Holy Scripture. I look forward to supporting you and your work for many years to come.Samuel Martin – www.biblechild.com – info@biblechild.comPosted by Samuel Martin at 1:31 PM
Samuel Martin responds to Prof. Thomas R. Schreiner’s review of Prof. William Webb’s book, Corporal Punishment in the Bible: A Redemptive-Movement Hermeneutic.
Note: Samuel Martin is the author of Thy Rod and Thy Staff They Comfort Me: Christians and the Spanking Controversy. You can read an excerpt from his book here.
Here are more responses to Prof. Thomas R. Schreiner’s review by both Prof. William Webb (The Author) and Rachel Stone (blogger).
Pearl in Oyster (PIO) shares some really helpful advice which is sure to help avoid frustration in your household. This post is from her 52 Tool Cards series and is called, Eye to Eye.
She mentions a child’s brain development in her post which brings me to an excerpt from Samuel Martin’s newest book in which he shares why it does not make sense to punish young children for sins before they are even old enough to understand sinning.
( Part 1 ) ( Part 2 ) ( Part 3) (Part 4) (Part 5)
This will be the conclusion of this series in which we have explored and discovered some of the origins of spanking children within Christianity. It was my goal to show that spanking is from man and not God, as so many well-meaning Christians have believed throughout the ages. In this paper, I will show how the idea of controlling children dates back to the early church in the ancient world, look at how Catholicism has advocated and used physical punishment with children, show the likely origin of the “Christian rules of how to spank children,” and will conclude with explaining Behaviorism and how physical punishment falls under that very old and outdated branch of Psychology.
The Origins of the Christian Need to Control Children
Many Christian advocates of spanking as well as the parents who follow these advocates are often quite concerned with controlling their children’s behavior, and really, one could say controlling their children. Advocates such as James Dobson, the Ezzos, the Pearls, and others teach parents that they must be in control of their children from birth. They claim that newborn infants must be taught that their parents are the bosses, not them. If this sounds familiar, it is because control and breaking children’s wills go hand and hand. We’ve seen how breaking the child’s will has been advocated for and done by Christians throughout history despite there being no biblical grounds for doing such a thing (See Parts 1, 2, & 3 for more info on breaking children’s wills). This need for adults to control their children dates back to New Testament times. In fact, certain verses of the New Testament are used to try and justify controlling one’s children. [Read more...]
Samuel Martin’s newest post reaches out to the Spanked and seeks ideas on how to help them convey their viewpoints to their parents.
Meanwhile, Libby Anne has shared 2 posts sharing her testimony of how her parents’ adherence to the Pearls’ teachings affected her:
Giving the Child the Rod, in which she shares about how she ruined her relationship with her siblings by wielding the rod on them and,
Casting the Pearls back to the Swine, in which she shares about how she decided not to follow those teachings with her own daughter.
Samuel Martin discusses what it means to be a Good Neighbor to your family in this look at the parable of the Good Samaritan which he illustrates with scenes from a blog post by Dulce de Leche.
“I Was Just Thinking…” blog looks at Na’ar in Proverbs…what kind of child are parents to strike?
Here are more of her thoughts about spanking.
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