More Pearl Exposure

The Wartburg Watch apparently just found out about the Pearls and are properly shocked.  I’m so glad that more sites are speaking out.   Nothing really new here, but this is a pretty good synopsis and good to share with those who may not yet know.  They promise to do more investigating.  I’ll be watching for it.

Close Encounters of the Pearl Kind

Someone finally noticed that I have a discussion board on my Facebook Page.  So far, there is only one discussion there, so far and I found it so interesting, I thought I’d share for those who have not joined Facebook.

This is Stephanie’s story of her close encounter with Pearl’s followers:

With my second pregnancy (1st baby) I got dropped by my midwife. I searched the internet for another and there are not many where I live, I was 35 weeks I think. I met with one and I hired her because ” none of the other midwives like because she is so hands off”. Well, that what she said and that what I wanted. She hosted Centering Pregnancy and Parenting and was a La Leche League leader and also a Bradley childbirth instructor. Anyways after my Daughter was born I went the Centering Parenting group every 2 weeks or so and LLL. She also hosted a bunch of different classes and such and I became friends with some of the people who attended. I noticed that she was ultra conservative, but I don’t like to judge one’s character on political or religious bases. I like to think of myself as open minded and make friends with people from all walks of life and different interests. She said some peculiar things that I just brushed off. Example: when talking to a mother with a newborn that was having trouble nursing “just tell him no and not to do that. I think babies understand right and wrong, whats expected of them.” She asked which church we went to and she said ” I have my own church at my house”

I was becoming friends with a lady that lived down the street from me, we met at the LLL meeting. We had a lot in common, I think, and hit it off. The second time I visited her she showed me this book called Help Meet. She raved about how wonderful this book was and showed me her favorite chapter called “Mommy why am I so dumb?” Really, that’s what it’s called. She said she was starting up a club for this book and would have all her friends over and I was invited. I went. There were a lot of kids at the Help Meet club.

At this club they discussed the book and had extras to pass out. It was defiantly disturbing the things some of the women said. About how the wife is supposed to never, ever turn down sex from her husband. That if a woman is beaten by her husband then it’s her fault and quote “Too bad for her” with a very smug attitude. That it is a sin to wear pants and to ask your husband’s permission to buy anything, including toothpaste or any necessities. I left early and asked to borrow the book out of curiosity and because I didn’t want them to think I was being rude for leaving early. Just because I didn’t agree with it or like some of the women there didn’t mean I didn’t want to be friends with her.

Anyways the woman I was becoming friends with, lets call her Sarah, invited me to her baby shower. I didn’t think I would make it because it was being held at someones house about 30 miles away. But I did. I met lots of other moms and kids. You know I thought that since the women I was hanging out with were Attachment Parenters or similar, because they exclusively breastfed, used slings and the like and bedshared. Anyways halfway through the party a women handed her baby off and grabbed her son by the arm and dragged him off to the stairwell. Three rooms away I could hear WHACK, WHACK WHACK! and then the crying. He was crying so hard. and after he stopped again WHACK, WHACK WHACK! and then the crying. Three times this happened while I was there. I wanted to stop it, I wanted to do something. But everybody around me was acting like nothing was happening. Like this happened all the time. I left. And I felt horrible for leaving that little boy there to be beaten. Something inside me just snapped. I don’t know I just had to get my daughter out of there. I cried on the way home and told my daughter that I would never, ever hurt her. For about three days I dwelled on this, I couldn’t believe I hadn’t stopped it. Finally I emailed one of the ladies that was at the party about it and asked if anybody stopped it and such. The lady I emailed was one of the midwives at my birth. That day I got and call from my midwife, the head midwife the one that owned the business. She told me she was to explain what happened at the baby shower, because the other midwife didn’t know what to say. She talked down to me like How dare I even think about stopping the beating. She said it was the mothers right to her her child and that she knows how hard and how long to hit for that child. And quote she said “I have to practically beat my kid with a bat to get him to listen”. Then she tried to get me to buy her book “To train up a child” I just sat there and listened in stunned silence and finally I said I’m going now and she kept saying I love you and I hung up. I was thinking you don’t know what love is. That night I researched the book, I was horrified. I just don’t get why anyone would ever want to hurt their baby. I kept thinking this goes against very thing the Bible teaches. The phone call was on Wednesday I called CPS on friday just to talk to someone about what happened, but they didn’t want to talk they just wanted info. Apparently CPS and Metro showed up on Saturday at the midwife’s house. I don’t know what happened, nor do I want to know. I do feel horrible about CPS showing up.

As for the kids that I met. The two that struck me the hardest were two of the teenagers I met. One was the 1st born she always had this nervous anxious smile on her face and if she wasn’t doing something she was very antsy. Depressed eyes and a nervous smile. I only saw the boy once, he was sitting at the table doing school work I asked him if there were any trashbags around. Without saying a word he sighed got up and got me one. No eye contact. He definitely seemed depressed to me. Run down, broken spirit. That was my impression of those two way before I even knew what their moms did to them. The kids that I met never really seemed like they were playing like it was a fake play because their moms told them too.

I think the people the buy into these kind of teachings have a serious lack of faith. They lack the faith to believe Jesus can and has touched many lives since his time here. They don’t have enough faith to believe that God is all powerful, more powerful than the devil, so powerful that many, many people believe in him, so powerful that the devil does not rule the earth, so powerful that even I and my brother whom were both raised in the most unGodly home now and have always believed and are both saved. They lack the faith that God is forgiving and compassionate and loves ever single person unconditionally. The most powerfull phrase in the Bible in my opinion, is when Jesus was on the cross, he said “forgive them, for they know not what they do”. He forgave the Jews, the people that beat him and then murdered him. He forgave them with compassion, love and understanding. He didn’t punish them but forgave. These people teach punishment over forgiveness and understanding. God gave us free will, the pearls take it away.

If you have a story to share, please join in the discussion. If you prefer to share anonymously, you may email your story to me or register here under a pseudonym and submit it.

Why Do People Blame the Pearls?

This post by Elizabeth Esther was written in Feb of 2010 as a response to the Schatz Tragedy.  It is a great post for sharing as it contains a careful explanation of the Pearls’ teachings and how they relate to Lydia’s death as well as her own personal testimony. A link to this post can also be found on In Depth Analysis of Pearl’s Teachings.

Positively Feminine’s Review of TTUAC

Brenda King at Positively Feminine has posted a review of To Train Up A Child. This is an excellent review containing quotes from the book and Biblical arguments against the teachings.

In Memory of Lydia Schatz

Sunday, Feb 6, 2011 was the first anniversary of the death of Lydia Schatz.  Here are the posts I have found in memory of her so far

In memory of Lydia Schatz by ukrainiac in which she gives a brief summary of the story and links to Tulip Girl’s post.

Remembering Lydia Schatz by Tulip Girl who gives an emotional explanation of exactly what happened and how and updates with current trial information. She also reminds us of Sean Paddock who died on Feb 26, 2006.

in memory of lydia schatz by That Mom who gives a short summary and refers us to Tulip Girl and Parenting Freedom.

When Religion Becomes Cult-Like and Deadly from Parenting Freedom which contains 4 quotes from Pearl’s teachings to illustrate the dangers therein.

Who Tells You How to Discipline Your Child? by Stephanie @ My Awful Beautiful Life

TTUAC: The Good, The Bad and The Shocking

Elizabeth, at Virginia Is For Mothers, reviews To Train Up A Child. In part 1 she shares her overall reaction which is mixed, and then what she found Good and Helpful about the book. I agree that there are some good and helpful messages in that book. To say otherwise is to put up a wall between us and those who are so taken by the good that they downplay the bad or don’t see it at all. There is a lot of good and that is what makes the book so dangerous. Nobody would eat a bitter tasting poison, it needs to be mixed with honey if anyone is going to eat it. And yes, this is is a very good honey.

But Elizabeth is not fooled. She says:

Here’s what I think about To Train Up A Child: SIGH….these people are such a mixed bag of normalcy and wisdom with a whole lot of weird thrown in. It takes a lot of concentration to weed through the information and advice to find pieces that I think are reasonable and biblical. Once again, I did glean some encouragement and reminders to do what I already believe in doing. So, I’m going to start with that and later write about the (many) parts of the book that had me raising my eyebrows, cringing and picking my jaw up off the floor.

Which brings us to Part 2 in which she reminds people not to fall into the error of relying to heavily on one parenting method and then shares what she found Weird, Harsh and Downright Shocking.  She includes plenty of quotes to back up her conclusions.  I’m glad that she is participating in warning people about this book.

The Schatz Abuse Story and the Paradise Post

As 2010 winds to a close, I am reflecting on the changes to this website.  I moved to this blog in March during the thick of the Schatz story.  Over the months I found more and more time passing between posts and started filling that time with posts about other controlling groups such as the Patriarchy Movement as well as helpful posts about Gentle Discipline.  I am very thankful to God for how He has been using this blog.  I wish my readers many blessings in 2011.

And now, The Paradise Post has released its Top 10 news stories of 2010 and the Schatz Abuse Story was number one.   I  post an excerpt from their story here for permanence:

Schatz, Smith lead top 10 news

Posted: 12/30/2010 01:00:00 AM PST

Once again the Post staff voted on the Top 10 stories of the Year. This year, the top story is the Schatz family abuse case.

1. Parents arrested in child abuse case

The ugliness of humanity reared its head in Paradise this year when two local parents allegedly beat their adopted daughter to death for mispronouncing a word.

Lydia Schatz, 7, died in February and her parents, Kevin and Elizabeth Schatz, are accused of killing her by using controversial disciplinary methods outlined in a religious training book, “To Train Up A Child,” by Michael and Debi Pearl, founders of the No Greater Joy Ministry.

In the aforementioned book, the Pearls recommend using a rubber quarter-inch plumbing supply line for disciplining a child. Elizabeth called emergency crews on Feb. 6 to report that Lydia was not breathing.

A storm prevented the girl from being airlifted to the hospital by the LifeFlight helicopter. Lydia was being rushed by ambulance to Chico Municipal Airport, but died en route. The autopsy of Lydia shows that the girl died of Rhabdomyolysis, a rapid breakdown of skeletal muscle due to injury to muscle tissue.

Lydia’s 11-year-old sister was also discovered with injuries and sustained kidney failure. She was not originally expected to survive, but made a full recovery after treatment at Sutter Memorial Hospital.

The Schatzes have six biological children and adopted Lydia, the 11-year-old, and a 3 month-old from the Republic of Libera in Africa.

Police said all the children made statements affirming being disciplined by rubber tubing found in the Schatz home.

The parents were charged with murder and torture, each facing life in prison. Kevin and Elizabeth retained separate lawyers and pled not guilty to the crimes.

The case has not been resolved. The Schatzes are scheduled to appear in court on Feb. 28, 2011 for a jury trial.

Lexie’s Thoughts on Child Training

Lexie Ahada from The Road Less Traveled has posted her arguments against the Pearls’ teachings, along with a long excerpt from To Train Up a Child. in her post, My Thoughts On Child Training.

Does Punishment Really Produce Godly Character?

I just found out about the group known as the Assembly under the ministry of George and Betty Geftakys. I had not heard of them before this, but as they were using the teachings of Michael and Debi Pearl (as well as Fugate and Ezzo,) they are of interest.  Apparently, they are another cultic and spiritually abusive group.   In fact, Betty Geftakys had her own pamphet about child training which almost makes the Pearl’s training methods look mild by comparison.

The post I want to highlight today is from Meg, a former member of that group,  and is entitled, Does Discipline Really Produce Godly Character…?

So Much More Than a Maiden Of Virtue

Wondering One is telling her story, I Am So Much More Than A Maiden Of Virtue, over at No Longer Quivering. In Chapter 3 she shares how her parents discovered Michael and Debi Pearl’s book To Train up a Child. If you start at chapter 1 and then read chapter 2 and chapter 3 you will find that it is a very gripping, albeit disturbing, story about punitive parenting from the child’s point of view.

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To Wreck a Train and Ruin a Child

Here is another warning from someone who tried using the teachings in To Train Up A Child found the results to be disastrous.  She also has insight into the raising of sheep, which is helpful.

The Explaination

One-hit_wonder has posted a very impassioned explanation of why she feels so strongly about the Pearls’ teaching that she was willing to cause family strife by speaking out against them. I also want to thank her for using my TTUAC quotes and linking to me. <3

What a Train Wreck

LivingForEternity has posted an confession / testimony at No Longer Quivering called, Family Man, Family Leader ~ To Train a Child – What a Train Wreck where she shares how the book To Train Up A Child almost destroyed her family.

Living Creatively’s book review of TTUAC

Living Creatively has posted a book review of To Train Up a Child called, To Train Up a Child OR you could call it How to Abuse a Child.

She started her research when a friend asked her about the book and was properly shocked. She gives her own thoughts and then shares another review and some good links.

This blog writer is not against spanking, she says so in the comment section of her post, so I am tagging it appropriately.

Homemaker’s Corner Examines the Pearls

At first glance, Mary Stephens of the Homemaker’s Corner looks like a typical Pearl follower.  She is strictly King James Only and believes strongly in submissive wives who are keepers at home.  However, she uses God’s Word as her light and the Pearls’ persuasive prattle did not fare well under the searching light of Scripture. She has written an in depth examination of the Pearls. This is not limited to Michael and Debi, but also includes Rebekah and her husband as part of the Pearl Family.

This is quite an undertaking she has started.  She apparently has not had time to finish her study, having only answered 3 out of the 8 questions she presents.  However, she already has quite a lot up there and I find it quite interesting on a few levels.

For one thing, this is the first time that I have noticed someone who feels strongly that the King James Bible is the only real Bible speaking out against the Pearls. While Michael Pearl does, indeed, use KJV only; she determines that he does not always use it correctly.  She also brings up the very valid concern that Pearl appears to believe that the KJV more than the original Greek. (!)

She exposes the fact that the Pearls use very little scripture to back up their conclusions.  She actually counts the scriptures they use.  The has done a very thorough investigation here. Her conclusion is:

From reading their material it appears that the Pearls are basically offering their own homebrewed child psychology. A little psychology, a little Bible and a lot of the Pearls’ philosophy and ideas go into the mix.

Another good  observation is how Pearl seems to have undue influence over his followers and how dangerous that is.  Here is another quote from the link in the above paragraph:

Please notice how the Pearls’ speaking, leadership and words have become so important in these people’s home. This is pathetic. Where is God’s word? Why is it that she feels they would benefit so much more from having the Pearls right there to help them? They have the God of the universe, the Almighty, the Great I AM, the Creator of the human race and the Institutor of the family indwelling them if they are saved! And, if they possess the King James Bible, they have His very words and instructions for mankind in their own hands and language. Isn’t that enough?! Apparently the Pearls’ teachings have conveyed to them that God and His word are not enough! This is horrifying.

She also has posted a critique on Debi Pearl’s study of the book of Esther.

I have not found her saying anything anti-spanking so I’m going to assume that I have found another pro-spanker speaking out against the Pearls teachings and tag it according.  I also base this assumption on what she said about discipline in her ABC’s of Raising Children (under D for Discipline).

Edited to add: Mary has clarified her position on spanking in a comment to this post.

Parenting Gems

Signs of Life blog warns us about the Pearls’ teachings and offers some Parenting gems as an alternative.

Why the teaching of Michael Pearl … is grossly in error and dangerous

Why the teaching of Michael Pearl regarding child raising (and other things too) is grossly in error and dangerous by Mamame from Life on the Sound.

Counter Arguments 4

Karen made a comment on Train Up Your Child at Awful Library Books to which I would like to reply.

Perhaps the person who put this in the “awful books” category should have read the positive as well as negative reviews on Amazon…the list of things from the book were from the top negative review there. Here is one that might give you all a little clearer perspective on the other side of the spanking debate, if you’ll actually bother to read it. :^)

Ok, that is fair. And I would like to share my responses.

Read the Actual Book and Be Honest with Yourself, May 22, 2010
By BLB (Oregon, USA) – See all my reviews

This review is from: To Train Up A Child (Paperback)
The actual book does not promote child abuse. The problem is, it requires parents using it to have enough self-discipline and character to use corporal punishment consistently, calmly, in a measured way, and without reflection of their moods. It doesn’t allow for using corporal punishment exclusively, either.

It is true that Michael Pearl says in the book not to abuse your children. The problem is that he never explains how to follow his advice without abusing. Would not the very act of training an infant by “switching” him be abusive?  Nor does he explain where chastisement ends and abuse starts. He never says how many licks is ok and how many would be abuse. Nor does he define abuse by how long to keep spanking. He does say that if you are not 100% consistent that you will fail. He also says that you should keep on spanking until their yelling stops and turns into a submissive whimper. He does not explain what to do if you keep spanking for hours at a time and there is still no submissive whimper.

The authors are farm people who train their own horses. They’re used to a situation where they’re dealing with a creature that can’t be effectively trained with either verbal reasoning or fear, a creature that could endanger itself or others if it is not disciplined properly. They raised their children on a traditional farm, a place full of serious physical dangers, where learning the hard way isn’t an option that a loving parent can consider.

I don’t know of any horse trainers who hit their horses. On top of that, children are not animals they are people, made in the image of God. Why would we compare them to animals?

The truth is, the Perls sound like affectionate, non-blaming people as well as unusually patient and self-controlled people. They are people who have learned to look at things from the perspective of the one they are training. For instance, they stress that there is no way to discipline a child without having a positive relationship with her. A child raised by the Perls would be eager to please them, because the relationship would not be primarily based on getting a spanking when you mess up. I would predict that there would actually be very little spanking in their home, and no yelling, verbal abuse, or emotionally damaging drama. It would be miles better than a lot of “no-spanking” houses. I wonder how many of the people decrying this book provided their children with a home that was as predictable and free from emotional abuse as I expect that the Perl household is, or if their children had the self-control that the Perl children did. Unfortunately, there are many people who don’t know that raising a child fit for polite company without a lot of emotional drama is even possible.

There is very little spanking because they have already trained the child. I object to the very act of training children in this way. This is behavior conditioning. Pearl even brags about how his grown children would drop an iced tea if he were to say, “hot.” I consider what Pearl teaches to be the crown jewel of emotional abuse. The children are switched for any emotion except for happiness until they no longer even feel any other emotion. I feel sick even thinking about it.

If you’re going to spank your child, this is a good book to read, almost a must. As you read it, though, be very honest with yourself about whether you exercise the kind of self-control and humble attitude that the Perls assume you have. If you don’t have that kind of self-control, you can read it and try to substitute other feedback for the spankings, but you’ll still need to learn the respectful, kind, patient consistency that is actually the foundation of the Perls’ method. You have to take in the entirety of the message. Look at what kind of parents the Perls are suggesting you be. Don’t even consider using corporal punishment if you can’t be that.

This book has some “pearls” in it, but readers should not fool themselves. It is not primarily about spanking. If you make it into that, you will fail.

I don’t agree that this book is a good book to read. It is true that there is some truth in it and even some good advice. But I consider the bad advice so dangerous as to be like rat poison. Rat poison is mixed with sugar to make it easy to eat, but it is no less dangerous.

Also consider that there are strong-willed children for whom corporal punishment is never going to work, because they will refuse to be motivated by anything short of abuse, and will resent that even if they eventually capitulate. You may as well try to break a zebra to harness. A parent has to realize that, and absolutely never try corporal punishment with a child like that. That would lead to spectacular failure and ruination of the relationship with the child.

Ok, this I agree with. And an adopted child is likely to fall into that category and should never be spanked.

Another pro-spanker speaks up

Another negative book review of TTUAC by a pro-spanker. I’m praising God that more people are taking a stand against this book. Jenni Lenc has good insight as to some of the major problems with these teachings, although she is careful not to be too harsh in her condemnation of them. A very good piece to share with Pearl followers who are asking you to explain your concerns.

To Train Up a Child by Michael and Debi Pearl from His Story In Lenc

Awful Library Books

The Awful Library Books blog would like to see  To Train Up A Child removed from all libraries.  So far, nobody in the comments section has approved of the book, but some feel that it should be just removed from the Parenting section and put somewhere else where those who need it for research can access it.  I agree.  We cannot argue against something without having access to it and we do not want to purchase it.

Anyway, I suggest you check your own public library and direct them to this post.  Suggest that they remove this dangerous book from the parenting section to a research section or remove it from circulation.

The Greater Problem…Parenting

Mommy Joy explains the inherent danger of blindly following any parenting philosophy in The Greater Problem…Parenting.

Secular Homeschooling Magazine

The homeschooling movement is taking notice of the Pearls. Secular Homeschooling is a rather large magazine and they have written an exposé of the Pearls and their teachings. She looks at all aspects of the Pearls and gives some advice on how to respond when offered the book at a homeschool gathering.

To Train Up a Child: The Greater Problem by Deborah Markus

Counter Arguments 2

I’ve been mulling over a follow up to my Counter Arguments post for almost a month now.  Recently Crystal was kind enough to leave me a comment, letting me know her disagreement with this site.  This was very helpful because it allows me to address her concerns.

I will quote her and respond to her concerns point by point.

This is utterly ridiculous. For those of you who are jumping on the bandwagon without reading the whole book you are really missing out on what God has intended for you and the joy you and your children can have.

First of all, I should explain that this website is not a bandwagon. This is a clearing house of information. I mainly link to arguments. As I said in my reply comment, I have read the whole book To Train Up A Child and as far as I know, so have most of those who whom I link. I am a bit mystified as to how you can know that we are missing out on what God has intended for us. We have read a book and found much of the content to be problematic (to put it mildly). We studied it and wrote well thought out arguments explaining our points of view. How is that missing out on what God intended for us? I assume you mean that by refusing to follow Pearl’s advice you feel that we are missing out. I maintain that I would never want the “joy” of training my children in that way. Nor do I believe that the Bible calls me to do that. I do not study the Bible in only English, I study the Hebrew and Greek words and try to get the real meaning.

The bible clearly states, “he that spares the rod, spoils the child” If you do not spank your children then what exacltly is working for you?

Now, when you say, “rod,” what exactly do you mean? Did you use the dictionary to get the English definition or did you study the Hebrew meaning of the word? Here is a word study on the rod so that you can really understand what the Bible says.

Edited to add: It has been pointed out in a comment below that “he that spares the rod, spoils the child” is not even in the Bible. Thank you, C.L. Dyck

Now, not everyone to whom I link is arguing against spanking. Here is a list of people who do believe in spanking but still have concerns about Pearl’s teachings.

Do you have sweet children? Do they obey you the first time?

Children are people. They are sometimes sweet and sometimes not, just as are adults. I can’t speak for everyone else, but my goal is not to have sweet children who obey me the first time. My goal is to raise healthy, thinking adults who love God. And I can’t make them that way, only God can. I can certainly do my best to guide (or train up, if you will) them onto the right road. I explain and lead by example. I allow them to question me and explain themselves. I do enforce obedience, I just don’t expect them to obey me without thinking first. And lest you think that my children will turn out badly, just know that they are already 19 and 17 years old and I get many complements on their behavior.

Or do you have to count to ten and call them 10 times before exploding and yelling at them, those are the kind of people who end up “spanking” but really its abuse because they got so mad and really end up despising their children because they hate to be around them.

You are not describing non-spankers, you are describing the permissive. I do not recommend permissive parenting. I recommend gentle discipline. You can learn more about that at Arms of Love Family Fellowship and in these posts.

People who spank there children in a calm manner and who are absolutely consistant 100 % of the time will have tremendous success.

If you define success as children who are always sweet and obey the first time, yes, they will usually have success. Unless their child is a special needs child. Some children will continue to defy and refuse to submit. Now most parents will figure this out and try something else. It is very tragic when parents continue to apply the rod to children who will not submit because it has been proven that if switching goes on too much and for too long the child will die.

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However you will not have success with any approach unless you yourself have true joy. Children know if you are faking it. Joy is the byproduct of thankfulness and love. Your joy radiates to your children.

Okay. So, are you saying that any approach will work if the parents have true joy or just the Pearl’s method?

Michael Pearl also recomends spending so much time with your children, they are your first and foremost responsibility, they must know that you delight in there presence, get on there level, do what they enjoy, do somthing that makes them smile every 5 minutes. But does anyone say that on this website?

Many of the arguments I have linked to have mentioned that Pearl teaches many good things. But no matter how many good things he says, even one wrong or dangerous teaching means that one has to use extreme caution in following him. A little leaven leaventh the whole lump.

Also, his doctrine is full of heresy, as explained in the Parenting in the Name of God series. If you don’t want to read through the entire series, you can look at An Examination of the Pearl Method.

There are many more things I could go on and say but those who really want to know more know where they can get the information. I would love to compare a houseful of “Michael Pearl” children who love and reverence him and are a great addition to society to the “non spanked” let them do what they want group, who is probably still working at jack in the box with numerous tattoos and peircings, pregnant at 15 and has no relationship with their parents.

Okaaay. I believe that this is what is known as a “strawman argument.” It makes no sense.

Wait. Love and reverence who? I don’t want my children to revere anyone except for God.

What is wrong with a 15 yr old working at Jack in the Box? I think that would be a good thing, as long as s/he is also still in school. I know many teenagers who were not spanked and none of them were pregnant at 15. They don’t have piercings or tattoos either, although I fail to see what that has to do with anything.

It’s funny that you should mention not having anything to do with their parents because I know many who were raised by Pearl and Gothard methods who fall into that camp and none who were not spanked. I have noted that children who were raised by attachment parenting have great relationships with their parents. That is one reason I decided to use that method.

Edited to add: C.L. Dyck left an excellent response to Crystal’s comment here.

Suzanne’s Testimony

I just found a lovely new testimony and argument.

Drop The Training and Regret Less by Suzanne Parker

Letter to a Library

Brenda K.  has written a letter to her public library, asking them to remove To Train Up a Child from circulation. I am posting her letter in case someone might find a use for it. Note that she attached a print out of a news story about the Schatz case. You can find many such stories using my News catagory

Dear Library Staff,

The book To Train Up a Child by Michael and Debi Pearl of No Great Joy Ministries is, in my opinion, a danger to the children in our community. It is nothing more than a child abuse manual cloaked in promises of producing well behaved children. The advice outlined in this book and on the authors’ website, has been connected to the deaths of two children* (see attached news article), and one can only imagine the lasting physical and emotional damage inflicted upon thousands of other children whose parents have followed these teachings.

The authors claim their cruel methods are endorsed by God, yet they have no religious training or credentials. They take liberties in twisting scripture, and claim treating the smallest and weakest among us in a cruel fashion, is actually a demonstration of love. There is no mention of Jesus’ command to forgive “seventy times seven” or of showing true compassion and grace.

I firmly believe in freedom of speech, but feel the line must be drawn when it comes to promoting violence and cruelty toward children – especially in a community library which I and other reasonable parents help fund.

Additionally, I believe the Pearls’ advice encourages parents to break the law. The State of Ohio’s law regarding corporal punishment says:

§ 2151.031. [Civil Code] It is a criminal act to administer corporal punishment or other physical discipline, or to physically restrain the child in a cruel manner or for a prolonged period if it is excessive under the circumstances and creates a substantial risk of serious physical harm to the child. It is a criminal act to administer unwarranted disciplinary measures to child if there is a substantial risk that if conduct is continued it will seriously impair the child’s health or development.

It doesn’t take much imagination to see how easily their methods could result in serious and lasting impairment of a child’s health and development.

Attached are specific examples of some of the most egregious directives contained in the book. Quotes are taken from the seventeenth printing: April 2006 edition, copyright 1994.

Thank you for considering my request to have this book removed from your shelves.

Sincerely,
[Removed]

*Note: The attached news article mentions beating with plastic tubing. This book does not specifically mention plastic tubing, but it does recommend similar implements and says sometimes alternative ones must be found. Their website does specifically mention plastic tubing as an acceptable discipline tool. But regardless of what tool is used, both children’s parents were influenced by the overall message of this book.

* The Pearls admonish parents to “Train Up – Not Beat Up” (p.4), but the book thoroughly extols the value of repeated “switchings.” On page 1 they recommend rewarding a child’s “every transgression with a switching.” A switching is described throughout the book as striking a child on his bare skin with various rod-like objects.

* Child training is compared to training animals such as dogs, mules, and horses. (p.3,4)

* They suggest setting up children – including young babies who aren’t yet walking – to fail, and then switching them in order to “train them” to obey immediately. (p.5-8)

* They believe a baby’s crying is self-centered and manipulative, and on p. 8 insist newborns need “training”. On p. 9 they describe switching their 5 month old daughter’s bare legs with a 12-inch long switch from a willow tree, because she was trying to climb up steps.

* They believe parents should “not allow the child’s crying to cause them to lighten up on the intensity or duration of the spanking.” (p.46)

* The authors declare that the very nature of a child demands punishment by “whipping, paddling, switching, or belting” (p.46, under “The Power of Absolution”). Parents who don’t follow their methods are portrayed as indifferent, lazy, careless and neglectful (p.19) and “creating a Nazi” (p.47).

* On p. 49 and 50 they describe the procedure to administering punishment: “If you have to sit on him to spank him, then do not hesitate. And hold him there until he is surrendered. Prove that you are bigger, tougher, more patiently enduring and are unmoved by his wailing. Hold the resisting child in a helpless position for several minutes, or until he is totally surrendered.” The child is to “bend over on the bed or couch… Slowly begin to spank. If you go too fast, you may not allow time enough for the inner transformation to occur.” In the same section, the author says, “I have found five to ten licks are usually sufficient. As the child gets older, the licks must become more forceful if the experience is going to be effective in purging his rebellion. A general rule is to continue the disciplinary action until the child has surrendered.” (p. 49, 50)

* On p. 50 the authors claim “Any spanking, to effectively reinforce instruction, must cause pain” [emphasis in original]. It is most effective to strike a light rod against bare skin, where nerves are located at the surface. A surface sting will cause sufficient pain, with no injury or bruising. Select your instrument according to the child’s size. For the under one-year-old child, a small, ten- to twelve-inch-long, willowy branch (stripped of any knots that might break the skin), about one-eight inch in diameter is sufficient. Sometimes alternatives have to be sought. A one-foot ruler, or its equivalent in a paddle, is a suitable substitute. For the larger child, a belt or a three-foot cutting off of a shrub is effective.” (The reader is left wondering how administering punishment according to their recommendations, could not cause “injury or bruising”!)

* If a father spanks a child and the child cries for his mother, the mother should hit the child as forcefully as the father did – even if the father was being unduly harsh: “It is better for your child if you support an occasional injustice than to destroy the authority base by your open division.” (p.58)

* They recommend switching a three-year-old by administering “about ten slow, patient licks on his bare legs. He cries in pain. If he continues to show defiance by jerking around and defending himself, or by expressing anger, then she [the mother] will wait a moment and again lecture him and again spank him.” They recommend this until he is “totally broken.” (p.62)

* The authors recommend switching babies who cannot sleep and are crying, and to never allow them “to get up… To get up is to be on the firing line and get switched back down.” They speak approvingly of a mother who switched her 12 month old daughter for crying and not wanting to sleep. (p.63, 64)

* On p.67 and 68, co-author Debi Pearl retells how she switched the bare leg of a 15 month old she was babysitting, 10 separate times with a 12-inch long switch, for not playing with something she told him to play with. She believed he had a “selfish and rebellious spirit.”

* The Pearls recommend pulling a nursing infant’s hair if he bites his mother’s breast (p.7), and describe tripping their non-swimming toddler so she falls into deep water (p.70).

* Parents who are learning to “train” previously unruly children, are told to “grin” at the thought of hitting them: “Grin, because you have secret weapons: A Plan, Love, Patience, Reproof, THE ROD OF CORRECTION [emphasis in the original], Endurance….” (p.82, 83)

* On p. 83 the authors extol the wisdom of switching a seven-month-old baby boy: “If he is old enough to pitch a fit, he is old enough to be switched.”

Counter Arguments

Most people, upon reading a few quotes from To Train Up A Child, will need no further convincing that there are serious problems with these teachings. However, some people will have arguments to which you will need responses. For this reason, I am posting some thoughts to prepare you to express your counter arguments.

When you are confronted by someone who has read TTUAC and defends it, you must proceed with caution. Remember that someone who has spent a long time in the dark needs a soft light which then grows slowly in intensity. A sudden, harsh light will only cause them to shut their eyes tighter and flee.

First of all, keep in mind that they will not accept any argument from a non-Christian or someone who they consider to be unbiblical, such as someone who condemns spanking. For this reason, I have compiled some links to arguments which will fill their criteria here.

Pearl followers will often insist that the quotes you show them are not in the book at all. They have, as they often express it, “eaten the meat and spit out the bones.” If you remind them that not everyone is so discerning as they and that some people choke on the bones, they may make a small step in the right direction and stop recommending the book.

Pearl and his followers are saying that we are misquoting them. Pearl says that he says, “switches” and we replace it with “tree branches.” A switch is a tree branch, but not all tree branches are switches. It is best to use Pearl’s own words so that they cannot cry, “foul.”  In the same way, use the term, “switching,” instead of “whipping” or “beating.”  When trying to communicate with someone, using the language with which they are familiar is usually helpful.

They are also accusing us of taking his quotes out of context. No matter how long of a quote you use, it will probably always be “out of context” because there is no context where his words are acceptable unless you have been almost hypnotized (for lack of a better term) by reading the whole book.   Nevertheless, I try to use large quotes in hopes of avoiding that charge as well.

Their main argument is that there is a lot of good in the Pearls’ teachings. Almost all dangerous teachings have an element of good in them. No one uses rat poison straight, they mix it with something tasty. But no matter how much good there is, once there is a tiny amount of poison mixed in you have a dangerous concoction. There is also the illustration of baking brownies with just a tiny bit of doggie doo in it.   But don’t be harsh, just gently explain that a little leaven leaveneths the whole lump.

I hope you have found this helpful.  I will be on the look out for more arguments to address and I invite your comments.

Quotes from To Train Up A Child

When quoting from To Train Up A Child (written and published by Michael and Debi Pearl), we should be careful about paraphrasing. We are being accused of misquoting. Here are some quotes from the book, which is found online here. I got the page numbers from quotes which are in circulation (originating from stoptherod.net) but I painstakingly checked each quote in the book to make sure that I am using direct quotes.

The Pearls recommend switching infants only a few months old on their bare skin. They describe switching their own 4 month old daughter (p.9).

At four months she was too unknowing to be punished for disobedience. But for her own good, we attempted to train her not to climb the stairs by coordinating the voice command of “No” with little spats on the bare legs. The switch was a twelve-inch long, one-eighth-inch diameter sprig from a willow tree.

On p.60 they recommend switching babies who cannot sleep and are crying, and to never allow them “to get up.”

But what of the grouch who would rather complain than sleep? Get tough. Be firm with him. Never put him down and then allow him to get up. If, after putting him down, you remember he just woke up, do not reward his complaining by allowing him to get up.For the sake of consistency in training, you must follow through. He may not be able to sleep, but he can be trained to lie there quietly. He will very quickly come to know that any time he is laid down there is no alternative but to stay put. To get up is to be on the firing line and get switched back down.

On p.79 they recommend whipping a 7 month old for screaming.

A seven-month-old boy had, upon failing to get his way, stiffened clenched his fists, bared his toothless gums and called down damnation on the whole place. At a time like that, the angry expression on a baby’s face can resemble that of one instigating a riot. The young mother, wanting to do the right thing, stood there in helpless consternation, apologetically shrugged her shoulders and said, “What can I do?” My incredulous nine-year-old whipped back, “Switch him.” The mother responded, “I can’t, he’s too little.” With the wisdom of a veteran who had been on the little end of the switch, my daughter answered, “If he is old enough to pitch a fit, he is old enough to be spanked.”

On p.65 co-author Debi Pearl whips the bare leg of a 15 month old she is babysitting, 10 separate times, for not playing with something she tells him to play with.

After about ten acts of stubborn defiance, followed by ten switchings, he surrendered his will to one higher than himself. In rolling the wheel, he did what every accountable human being must do–he humbled himself before the “highest” and admitted that his interests are not paramount. After one begrudged roll, my wife turned to other chores.

On p.56 Debi Pearl trades blows with a 2 year old.

This time, her bottom came off the couch as she drew back to return the blow; and I heard a little karate like wheeze come from somewhere deep inside.

On p.59 they recommend whipping a 3 year old until he is “totally broken.”

She then administers about ten slow, patient licks on his bare legs. He cries in pain. If he continues to show defiance by jerking around and defending himself, or by expressing anger, then she will wait a moment and again lecture him and again spank him. When it is obvious he is totally broken, she will hand him the rag and very calmly say, “Johnny, clean up your mess.” He should very contritely wipe up the water.

On p.55 the Pearls say a mother should hit her child if he cries for her.

If a father is attempting to make a child eat his oats, and the child cries for his mother, then the mother should respond by spanking him for whining for her and for not eating his oats. He will then be glad to be dealing only with the father.

On p.46 the Pearls say that if a child does obey before being spanked, spank them anyway. And “if you have to sit on him to spank him, then do not hesitate. And hold him there until he is surrendered. Prove that you are bigger, tougher.” “Defeat him totally.”

Never reward delayed obedience by reversing the sentence. And, unless all else fails, don’t drag him to the place of cleansing. Part of his training is to come submissively. However, if you are just beginning to institute training on an already rebellious child, who runs from discipline and is too incoherent to listen, then use whatever force is necessary to bring him to bay. If you have to sit on him to spank him then do not hesitate. And hold him there until he is surrendered. Prove that you are bigger, tougher, more patiently enduring and are unmoved by his wailing. Defeat him totally. Accept no conditions for surrender. No compromise. You are to rule over him as a benevolent sovereign. Your word is final.

On p.80 they say

On the bare legs or bottom, switch him eight or ten licks; then, while waiting for the pain to subside, speak calm words of rebuke. If the crying turns to a true, wounded, submissive whimper, you have conquered; he has submitted his will. If the crying is still defiant, protesting and other than a response to pain, spank him again.

On p.47 they give details of what to use for a spanking instrument.

Any spanking, to effectively reinforce instruction, must cause pain, but the most pain is on the surface of bare skin where the nerves are located. A surface sting will cause sufficient pain, with no injury or bruising. Select your instrument according to the child’s size. For the under one year old, a little, ten- to twelve-inch long, willowy branch (striped of any knots that might break the skin) about one-eighth inch diameter is sufficient. Sometimes alternatives have to be sought. A one-foot ruler, or its equivalent in a paddle, is a sufficient alternative. For the larger child, a belt or larger tree branch is effective.

The Pearls  recommend pulling a nursing infant’s hair (p.7)

One particularly painful experience of nursing mothers is the biting baby. My wife did not waste time finding a cure. When the baby bit, she pulled hair (an alternative has to be sought for baldheaded babies).

They recommend hosing off a child outside in order to clean him if he continues to soil himself.

So, my suggestion was that the father explain to the boy that, now that he was a man, he would no longer be washed in the house. He was too big and too stinky to be cleaned by the babywipes. From now on, he would be washed outside with a garden hose.

Also, here are 3 quotes which I feel show some questionable doctrine:

The guilt burdened soul cries out for the lashes and nails of justice. Your child cannot yet understand that the Creator has been lashed and nailed in his place. Only the rod of correction can preserve his soul until the day of moral dawning.

The parent holds in his hand (in the form of a little switch) the power to absolve the child of guilt, cleanse his soul, instruct his spirit, strengthen his resolve, and give him a fresh start through a confidence that all indebtedness is paid.

A child properly and timely spanked is healed in the soul and restored to wholeness of spirit. A child can be turned back from the road to hell through proper spankings. “Withhold not correction from the child; for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell (Prov. 23:13, 14). (p. 44)

Note: I find it ironic that he recommends using plastic plumbing line for a rod and then objects when people say that he teaches people to whip children.

Now, here are some very disturbing quotes directly from their website.  You are going to have to go read this yourself to really appreciate it and believe that I did not take quotes out of context.

This is from Question #9: “Please give examples of the kinds of things for which you used the rod, both as a training tool and as punishment, for children were under 12 months.”

We never used the rod to punish a child younger than 12 months.

For young children, especially during the first year, the rod is used very lightly as a training tool. You use something small and light to get the child’s attention and to reinforce your command.

One or two light licks on the bare legs or arms will cause a child to stop in his tracks and regard your commands.

A 12-inch piece of weed eater chord works well as a beginner rod. It will fit in your purse or pocket.

Later, a plumber’s supply line is a good spanking tool. You can get it at Wal-Mart or any hardware store. Ask for a plastic, ¼ inch, supply line. They come in different lengths and several colors; so you can have a designer rod to your own taste. They sell for less than $1.00.

A baby needs to be trained all day, everyday. It should be a cheerful, directing training, not a correction training.

When your 6-month-old baby grabs sister’s hair, while he still has a hand full of hair, swat his hand or arm and say “No, that hurts sister.” If he has already let go of her hair, then put his hand back on her hair, so as to engage his mind in the former action, and then carry on with the hand swatting and the command.

If your 10-month-old is pitching a fit because he wants to be picked up, then you must reinforce your command with a few stinging swats.

Wait one minute, and then tell the baby to stop crying. If he doesn’t, again swat him on his bare legs. You don’t need to undress him, turn him over, or make a big deal out of it. Just swat him where any skin is exposed. Continue to act as if you don’t notice the fit. Wait two minutes and repeat.

Most babies will keep it going for 3 or 4 times and then slide to a sitting position and sob it out. When this happens, it signals a surrender, so give him two minutes to get control and then swoop him up as if the fit never happen and give him a big hug, BUT don’t hold him in the manner he was demanding. Now remove yourself from the area so as to remove him from association with the past event.

Don’t ever hit a small child with your hand. You are too big and the baby is too small. The surface of the skin is where the most nerves are located and where it is easiest to cause pain without any damage to the child. The weight of your hand does little to sting the skin, but can cause bruising or serious damage internally. Babies need training but they do not need to be punished. Never react in anger or frustration. If you loose it, get your self under control before you attempt to discipline a child.

Here is another quote from the No Greater Joy website.  This quote is from an article from 1998,  Angry Child.

A proper spanking leaves children without breath to complain. If he should tell you that the spanking makes him madder, spank him again. If he is still mad…. He desperately needs an unswayable authority, a cold rock of justice. Keep in mind that if you are angry you are wasting your time trying to spank his anger away.

I could break his anger in two days. He would be too scared to get angry. On the third day he would draw into a quiet shell and obey. On the fourth day I would treat him with respect and he would respond in kind. On the fifth day the fear would go away and he would relax because he would have judged that as long as he responds correctly there is nothing to fear. On the sixth day he would like himself better and enjoy his new relationship to authority. On the seventh day I would fellowship with him in some activity that he enjoyed. On the eight day he would love me and would make a commitment to always please me because he valued my approval and fellowship. On the ninth day someone would comment that I had the most cheerful and obedient boy that they had ever seen. On the tenth day we would be the best of buddies.

(Note that the quote above was linked to Stockholm Syndrome in an article in Secular Homeschooler which makes some interesting points.)

In an article called, Training Roseanna’s Flesh, Pearl explains how and why one must control a child at all costs.

For example: a child tries to slide from your lap onto the floor. On most occasions that’s just a way of letting you know where he wants to go. Fine, but there are times when you do not want him to slide to the floor. If your little fourteen-month-old makes an attempt to dismount your lap, and you indicate that you do not want him to, and he makes a protest by jerking away or whining, then by no means can you allow him to intimidate you into compliance. For, by so doing you have allowed the authority to pass to him. You would be encouraging rebellion. YOU MUST ALWAYS BE PERCEIVED TO WIN ANY CONTEST. It is all determined by what the child thinks. If there is a seed of resistance in the child, it must never be allowed to grow. Don’t allow that spirit of rebellion to become profitable.

When the child whines and makes an issue of something that to you was otherwise irrelevant, you must then follow-through, causing the child to do what he did not want to do. This is soul training – character building – sanctification of the natural spirit in your child. This won’t make him a Christian, but it will give him a better character than most Christians possess.

If, during the course of a day, no contest arises naturally, you should arrange one. Seek opportunity to thwart the child’s will, to cause him to submit to your command. If you cause him to surrender his will to you twenty times during the course of a day, he will not disappoint you with disobedience in public. Tell him to stop, sit, don’t speak for five minutes, etc. Play the half-hour “quiet time game,” the half-hour “don’t wiggle and squirm game.” Refuse him a treat when he is wanting it badly. Give it to him only when he is joyously submitted to your timetable. You mustn’t give the appearance of being blindly arbitrary, but always maintain full control. Never allow the child to dictate your actions.

I have found an article on the No Greater Joy site where Mr. Pearl explains some of his different terminology (aka DoubleSpeak) in regard to when a child is Too Young To Spank.  Here is a quote from that page discussing a 6 month old:

So we watch him, knowing his propensity to selfish compulsion. When he seizes his bowl with intentions of dumping it, swat the offending hand with a little instrument (light wooden spoon, rubber spatula, flexible tubing less than a quarter inch in diameter, or any instrument that will cause an unpleasant sting without leaving any marks).

Pro-Spankers’ arguments

Michael Pearl alleges that only those who are anti-spanking oppose his teachings. He has no idea how wrong he is. For your convenience, here is a compilation of arguments and concerns from Christians who approve of spanking:

To Train Up A Child (Book Review) by Tina Jobe

To Train Up A Child: An Examination of the Pearl Method by Rey Reynoso who had done a great job of digging deep and analyzing the Pearls’ teachings using the Bible to refute them.

Is Michael Pearl Responsible For a Girl’s Death?
Pearl Of Too Great a Price and
The Behavior Modification Gospel by Matthew Raley, a pastor who uses Tedd Tripp’s teachings in his church.

Fundamental Baptists warning about No Greater Joy Ministries

Michael Pearl’s Duplicity is the answer to Pearl’s response to his critics in Oct 2007

Mama D. used to recommend the Pearl’s teachings but has since taken another look and has now written about her concerns in a post entitled, “Spare the Rod, Spoil the Child.”

Mama D.  has also posted a 2 part book review of “To Train Up A Child”:
(Part 1) Book Review: To Train Up A Child
(Part 2) Book Review: To Train Up A Child

The Pearls and Your Child’s Heart from Raising Olives.  In case you need proof, she mentions her belief in spanking in the comments of this post.

To Train Up A Child? book review from The Watchman’s Bagpipes.

Michael and Debi Pearl – sample wisdom by Barbara Curtis from Mommy Life

Reflections on TTUAC by Jen at His Grace His Glory who has found much good in the Pearls’ teachings but has some concerns to share.

Michael & Debi Pearl, & Questions of Ministry Credentialing by Pastor Jack from New Covenant Living

Obviously, I’ve been away for awhile by Down To Earth Woman who expressed in a comment that she does not believe that spanking is wrong.

Chucklestravels has a few posts about Michael Pearl as well as Debi Pearl.

The Parenting In The Name of God series from Scitia Scienda who tells me that when he “corrects NGJ’s theology and parenting advice, he does so from a very solid positive experience of being “traditionally” parented by Christian conservatives who did believe in spanking, who have attended KJV-only and other fundamentalist/independent churches, who homeschooled their kids.”

For more, please check out my tag.

Zooey’s Arguments

It began with a feeling of uneasiness…..

I started to read what had been described to me as a “Christian book for women”. That seemed OK. I mean, I am a Christian woman. But I rapidly became more & more uncomfortable with what I was reading. There was a coarseness about it that jarred with my understanding of Christianity.
By the time I was only partway through, I was partly nauseous, & partly appalled that this little missive was being passed around in Christian circles. The name of the book was Created To Be His Helpmeet, by Debi Pearl….and not just the book, but Mrs Pearl was appalling me. Her husband’s contributions were even worse.

I was raised in a “ Holiness “ church. I had met all kinds of people with all kinds of convictions, many of which I found odd, but it never crossed my mind that these folks were anything other than genuine Christian people……and now I had my first encounter with the Family Pearl, and I devoutly wished I had never heard of them. Frankly, they scared me to death. And that was before I heard anything about their “child rearing” techniques. I had only one thing to go by: CTBHH. It was enough to send me back into my Bible, trying to find out in what manner these people could possibly have interpreted Scripture, in order to draw such bizarre conclusions from it.

I had been raised to be discerning, especially in the matter of Biblical interpretation. It didn’t take me long to realize that here was a strange  breed: These people were a “Bible-based cult”. I had never heard of such a thing; I had believed that cults were odd sects which clearly departed from the words of my Bible. Now, I was facing a cult that claimed to be rooted in Scripture. How could this be???
I should have remembered World History class. The fact that history was (& is) awash with the names of groups who also claimed to be “true Christians” whilst promoting another gospel—that should have been my tip-off.
It wasn’t. My tip-off was that queasy feeling in the pit of my stomach.
I wish it had been enough. Enough to enlighten me as to how insidious the Pearls & their skewed theology could be. It would take years, & an exposure to more of their poison, before I broke free of my “different people interpret Scripture differently” mentality, long enough to smell the whiff of sulfur that signaled that the Pearls were being inspired, all right; the problem was to awaken to who & what was their inspiration.
But, one thing was clear very early on: This was not the truth. This was not of God. And this was most definitely NOT Christian teaching. This is what the pastors of my childhood would have called “carnality”.

Thus it begins.

What I want to talk about is another book by Mr & Mrs Pearl: “To Train Up A Child”– hereafter, TTUAC.
The Pearls’ teaching flows from their theology. Their theology, that is, determines how they behave. Michael Pearl states that he has been “ teaching and living” a life free of sin.
He claims, that is, to be what my elders in the faith called “sanctified wholly [holy]”. (He spends a lot of time denying this, but it is in print on his own site. He says his position is that of Baptists; I have yet to meet a Baptist who believes this. Not even my grandfather, the Baptist minister’s son, & the Free Methodist local preacher, who surely knew what each believed!!).

Let me begin with what I was afraid might take the most time to find, & turned out to be as easy as calling up my own church’s website, & doing a little minor checking of links:
http://archives.umc.org/interior.asp?mid=1648

I am copying & pasting here, from :
http://archives.umc.org/interior.asp?ptid=1&mid=1653

Of Sanctification
Sanctification is that renewal of our fallen nature by the Holy Ghost, received through faith in Jesus Christ, whose blood of atonement cleanseth from all sin; whereby we are not only delivered from the guilt of sin, but are washed from its pollution, saved from its power, and are enabled, through grace, to love God with all our hearts and to walk in his holy commandments blameless.
[The following provision was adopted by the Uniting Conference (1939). This statement seeks to interpret to our churches in foreign lands Article XXIII of the Articles of Religion. It is a legislative enactment but is not a part of the Constitution. (See Judicial Council Decisions 41, 176, and Decision 6, Interim Judicial Council.)]

One of MP’s defenses, you see, is that what he believes is standard doctrine in a Christian church. He uses language which might easily lead readers to think that he is teaching the  standard Wesleyan sanctification.
Let’s examine that for a bit:

(A) “that renewal of our fallen nature by the Holy Ghost”.
What does that mean? Well, first, let’s say what it does NOT mean: It does not mean that when, upon salvation through faith, by the grace of God, we become regenerate [are saved; enter into a state of grace; accept Christ as Saviour; etc]. It does NOT mean that we never sin again. It does not mean that we can never sin again. Because look at what it says: “renewal of our fallen nature”.
Now a renewal means that something is made new again; not that it has just become new, but that something occurs after that initial ‘becoming’. My grandfather—would that he were here to explain it; he would surely do better than I!– He called this ‘entire sanctification’, and he knew that it meant something apart from salvation.
I know this for a very good and sufficient reason: He talked about it, studied it, read Wesley, and then…..He decided that as a born-again Christian, he could not claim something that he did not believe.
Which was when, before a gathering of Free Methodists over an area of several states, when he was asked (as every FM pastoral candidate—like UMC candidates—is asked), “Are you expecting to be sanctified wholly in this lifetime?” as part of his proposed ordination as a deacon, he said, after a long pause: “Well, truthfully, NO “ .

It was clearly not his salvation that was in question. Without that, he would have never been a candidate. No, it was something subsequent to salvation: entire sanctification in this lifetime.

(B) “ received through faith in Jesus Christ, whose blood of atonement cleanseth from all sin”
John Wesley did not preach  what has been called “cheap grace”. No, he preached that it is the duty of every Christian to grow, to increase in faith, and to live more and more closely to Jesus Christ so that we may be presented before Him on “That Day”, not with our sins merely “covered over”, but with them washed away, gone, that we may be as holy as we can be, that “we may not be ashamed”.
He & his younger brother Charles and their friends at university were called “The Holy Club” because of their constant striving to be as pleasing to God as was possible in this world. It was a taunt, but they accepted it, & gladly. It was, after all, what they sought to attain.
In time, they would be convinced that they were never to achieve it, and then, one night in Aldersgate Street, John Wesley wrote, “My heart was strangely warmed”, and he realized that as we are saved by the blood of Christ, so are we also:

(C)”whereby we are not only delivered from the guilt of sin, but are washed from its pollution, saved from its power”. We are not able to make ourselves holy any more than we are able to make ourselves regenerate. It is Christ, & Christ alone Who can make us live holy lives. It is to God alone that the glory for sanctification is due. And then we :
(D) “and are enabled, through grace, to love God with all our hearts and to walk in his holy commandments blameless”.
And it is here is where the Pearls go terribly, terribly wrong. Here is where they lose all touch with  sound Christian doctrine. Because they teach that the “rod” which they call for using on children can cleanse from guilt. Only the shed blood of Jesus Christ on the cross of Calvary can do that. Anyone who says otherwise is teaching another ‘gospel’, as the Apostle Paul warned us, and said of such a teacher, “ If we, or an angel from Heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, if anyone preaches another gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed”. (Galations 1: 8-9).
I am not a theologian. I have never pretended to be.
But when my Bible says, twice in as many verses, that anyone who preaches anything other than “Jesus Christ and him crucified”, that that teacher is a false teacher; and that such a teacher is to be accursed–
When that happens, I say, I am fearful. And I put down that book, TTUAC, and I put down Mrs Pearl, & I put down NGJ Ministries, and I stand well back from it, and from every word that comes out of the Pearls’ mouths and pens.
Because I remember also what Paul said, of himself, that he prayed “lest [he] should be a castaway”. Michael Pearl, & NGJ has claimed for a piece of wood (or perhaps even more bizarrely, for a piece of rubber hose) what the Bible claims only, ONLY for Christ Himself, & Him crucified.
This is serious business, folks. This is not a small matter. He who is not with the crucified Christ is not with us; is not of us. And there are only two positions where we can stand:
We can stand with Jesus Christ. Or we can fight against him.
When it comes to a choice between Michael  & Debi Pearl’s TTUAC (& the rest of their writings), and the One With the Nail-Scarred Hands….For me there is no choice. I will stick with the Christ who suffered & died for me.
Whose side are you on??

- Zooey

TTUAC Book Review

A review of “To Train Up a Child” by MissusLeata